Filed under: Software, Odds and ends
Microsoft's motto continues to be "If you can't beat 'em, steal from 'em"
Speaking of copying... allow me to echo a bit of what Scott mused on this morning.Instead of relying solely on features from Apple's Tiger to flesh out their years-in-the-marketing OS, Microsoft is going so far as to copy Apple's copying! Well they didn't go that far. They looked only toward Seattle. Let me explain....
You remember how when Dashboard was announced everyone accused Apple of essentially repackaging Konfabulator and calling it their own? Well Redmond's been reading the same play book.
During the WinHEC keynote today, Gates demoed a new app that Windows users can expect to see in about 2 years. It's called Delicious Library. Oh wait... no it isn't. It only acts like Delicious Library. It's actually called Media Mania. Don't let the name fool you, though... it's Delicious Library... only uglier.
Wil Shipley the Chief Monster at Delicious Monster Software noticed the similarities immediately. In an email sent to a site loftier than ours, Wil said:
"I know this sounds like a joke, but check out the screenshots (here, here and here) from his keynote at WinHEC. Hey, if only there were some way that you could have an online catalog of books, movies, music, and videogames... and what if you displayed the full-size covers of those items, and there was a search field to refine your choices, and a slider to zoom in and out, and you could buy an item with a single click? Yah. Someone should invent something like that."
Gosh, Wil... tell us how you really feel, man!
Wil goes on to say that one of the only (if not the only) differences he can find between Microsoft's app and his own is the "über-ugly look of their shelves" and the fact that Microsoft lets you view back covers. He reinforces his point by noting that even the categories are the same.
"You couldn't add any others?" Wil inquires, "Like, say, software titles? I mean, you're Microsoft, why would you not have a category for software? Oh, because WE didn't think of it for you? Zoom slider at the bottom? Couldn't be anywhere else? Search field at the bottom? I mean, come on, guys. Sure, you moved the categories to the top, but, seriously. This is just embarrassing for you."
Welcome to Redmond, my friends. Home of the 64-bit copy. Perhaps Microsoft should make a play to pry Kinkos away from FedEx? Seems like a perfect fit to me.
[thanks, Dan!]
Get a WordPress.com Blog
![TUAW [Cafepress]](http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.tuaw.com/media/tuaw-cafepress-promo.png)
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Fisher said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
The headline did not really tell me any thing... Now I HAVE to read the article... Ah man....
Reply
ketsugi said 12:51PM on 7-08-2005
I'm not sure about the search field, but it could be argued that the zoom slider at the bottom was copied from iPhoto...
Reply
Justin said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
I particularly like how they say Longhorn's search capabilities are doing things that NO ONE ELSE is doing.
"...a 'virtual folder' that dynamically updates the content based on criteria you select"
*cough*smartfolders*cough*
Real innovation.
I think I saw that app demoed in a developer interview sometime in March and they presented it mainly as an exercise in Avalon--but no doubt the designer who did the XAML had some "inspiration" =o)
Reply
janeiro said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
*cough*smartfolders*cough*
*cough*live queries*cough*
i was using it in 1999. its definitely nothing new. at least Apple got the guy who originally created it (Dominic Giampaolo) to redo it for Apple.
Reply
Pete M said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
Please, have a look at this link. The ORIGINAL video this demo app was shown in clearly states that it is just a CONCEPT DEMO that they wrote to show off new development techniques.
The reason Microsoft aren't copying Apply is because they are pioneering these new ways to present and develop applications. Do you really think you'll be seeing MediaMania by Microsoft ever?? Definitly not!
http://channel9.msdn.com/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=58634
Have a look at the video.
Microsoft often do these sample applications to demo ways to do code and function design.
Reply
D Jones said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
So what you're saying, Pete, is that it's not called copying because they're only using it internally and for developers? Potato, poTAHto. And it's not Apple they copied, it's Delicious Monster Software that they copied.
"Microsoft often do these sample applications to demo ways to do code and function design."
I'll agree with that. Microsoft often copies other applications to demo ways to do code and function design [so internal and 3rd party developers can get a headstart on copying applications from companies that are actually doing the innovation].
How nice of Microsoft to not only make a toolset that allows a simpler path for their partners to steal from other people's ideas and repackage them as their own.
Reply
Pedro said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
So Laurie how do you really feel?
Reply
Pete M said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
What hasn't been copied, and is a bigger innovation than Apple have attempted are the developer platforms - in this case Avalon:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/Longhorn/understanding/pillars/avalon/default.aspx
AFAIK this demo was created to show how a better collaboration between designers and programmers can be created, whilst showing how easy it is to create scalable vector based 3D effects just by using XML (or XAML).
Reply
Thom Brooks said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
"Someone should invent something like that." -- Someone did, and his name is Andrew Kazmierski!
The Delicious Irony here is the fact that Wil Shipley didn't invent Library either; he bought it off a bright 14-year-old kid named Andrew Kazmierski who had already written two major versions of his software, at the time simply called Library. At first, Andrew remained a part of the development team, but was slowly pushed out over time. AFAIK, he got paid for his efforts, but they don't talk much now.
I'm sure plenty of credit goes to Wil, Mike and the other Monsters for souping up the interface and adding plenty of new features. But it just irks me a bit that they can't even throw a little credit the kid's way, like on their website. He's in the 'About Library' dialog box in the app (for now..), but does not appear in any capacity on DL's website... probably because he no longer works for their company. Their brand-new company which they formed around someone else's product.
My .02; I gladly welcome corrections if I got it wrong somehow.
Reply
janeiro said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
Pete M: what's Quartz Extreme? what about the Cocoa libraries in general?
How bout a free development studio with built in graphical modeling? http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/xcode/
what about Tiger being resolution independent (how's that for scaling vector graphics?)?
Reply
William Shipley said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
I should point out that it's my personal opinion that this demo is a rip-off of Delicious Library. Mike actually disagrees -- he thinks it's a wild coincidence that they have all the similarities.
Also, I should point out that in my view Microsoft has EVERY RIGHT to make an app like this, or do a demo of an app. I don't believe in software patents and all that crud.
But it's just funny, to me, when they take someone else's idea and say, "Look, this is the kind of thing we can enable in two years! Wait for it! It's gonna be great!"
You can argue that it's not the same idea, that they came up with it independently. I think there are too many similarities for it to be coincidence.
Check out: http://www.mcatalog.net/
Note that this nice fellow actually copied the Delicious Library interfaces directly (and said as much). All I asked him to do was give us credit on his site, and I granted him a permanent license to use our interfaces for free. (Plus, he has our product name on his pagea, so it comes up if you search for open source versions of our program.) So, I'm not claiming "the idea of a library is mine for all time and nobody can touch it."
I'm saying, I think this demo was based on my work, and I don't like seeing it copied without getting credit.
-Wil
Reply
William Shipley said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
I should point out that it's my personal opinion that this demo is a rip-off of Delicious Library. Mike actually disagrees -- he thinks it's a wild coincidence that they have all the similarities.
Also, I should point out that in my view Microsoft has EVERY RIGHT to make an app like this, or do a demo of an app. I don't believe in software patents and all that crud.
But it's just funny, to me, when they take someone else's idea and say, "Look, this is the kind of thing we can enable in two years! Wait for it! It's gonna be great!"
You can argue that it's not the same idea, that they came up with it independently. I think there are too many similarities for it to be coincidence.
Check out: http://www.mcatalog.net/
Note that this nice fellow actually copied the Delicious Library interfaces directly (and said as much). All I asked him to do was give us credit on his site, and I granted him a permanent license to use our interfaces for free. (Plus, he has our product name on his pagea, so it comes up if you search for open source versions of our program.) So, I'm not claiming "the idea of a library is mine for all time and nobody can touch it."
I'm saying, I think this demo was based on my work, and I don't like seeing it copied without getting credit.
-Wil
Reply
Pete M said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
What's all this about a library anyway??
The program Microsoft demoed was one that did a search on Amazon's Web Service, returned the restults, giving you descriptions, and 3D product feedback, and then the option of a checkout, right there in the program.
Pete
Reply
Pete M said 4:17PM on 6-16-2005
I don't think the concepts seem to have that much similarity - but then I haven't used either.
It's not a library program, and the slider is to change the amount of product detail shown mainly. In fact I do not see any similarities.
Been having a look at Delicious Library - has some great ideas, like importing products via barcodes on iSight. Would be good when importing my DVD library in to my Media Center PC instead of typing in the barcodes.
Reply