Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Video
Don't expect an Apple DVR anytime soon
The reaction to the new Mac minis almost universally was, 'It is great, but what it really needs is a DVR.' Well,
Larry Angell, over at iLounge, just has to go and burst our bubble. He suggests
that perhaps you shouldn't hold your breath waiting for a DVR solution from Apple anytime soon.Why not? Because, Larry posits, Apple is selling TV shows on the iTunes Music Store, why would they enable Mac users to easily record the same shows that you can buy for them for free, and get them at a much higher resolution to boot.
Depressing, but it does make sense. Head on over to iLounge and read the whole thing for yourself.
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Kevin said 10:44AM on 3-03-2006
Well expect it before Vista, because Microsoft's next offering WILL have it... and Apple doesn't want to be last to the dance. =S
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Chris said 10:48AM on 3-03-2006
For all the hope out there, I find the idea of a Mac mini DVR sorta archaic. Why should you need a dedicated computer connected to your TV? Why not just have everything streamed, and controlled, wirelessly via a nice Airport Express with video? Your computer in the den/office or your laptop pumps your video to wherever you need it. Anywhere in the house. The media center PC as it currently exists is silly. Perhaps Apple is just waiting for 802.11n to be finalized before they roll something out?
Not to mention TiVo has done the dedicated hardware DVR for all these years and still can't make any money doing it. Why would Apple want to try to sell Mac minis as dedicated living room DVRs? It doesn't make sense.
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Jeff said 10:51AM on 3-03-2006
To me, it still makes sense. They aren't making that much money on the shows they sell from the iTMS. They do it in order to provide content for the 5G iPod. Sure, they make a few cents per movie, but their real profit is on the hardware side. If that's true, then the DVR still makes perfect sense, as long as they would provide a way to move the content to the iPod. It still fits their business model, and makes me very happy at the same time, :)
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kevin said 10:53AM on 3-03-2006
i agree with #2, it seems odd to me for that kind of functionality coming from a dedicated mac machine, unless it was some third-party app. the airport w/ video sounds a lot better and more in line with apple's style - compact, slick, and easy
and #1, vista is going to have built-in dvr capability? never heard that, where did you hear it? i'm genuinely curious, no internet sarcasm intended
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Kevin said 11:03AM on 3-03-2006
#3
Take a look at http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,1931916,00.asp
The whole article is actually pretty interesting... won't take me away from my Mac though!
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Steve said 11:17AM on 3-03-2006
Yeah, Vista is supposed to support CableCard, which means it will support DVR software, probably with a built-in Windows app similar to Front Row.
#2, great point. There's no need to have an entire Mac on your component rack. Just have a dedicated Front Row box hooked to the TV, controlled by the Apple Remote. This would be cheaper, smaller, and a nice addition to existing systems. The only thing you'd be losing from the set-top mini is DVD playback.
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James Donevan said 11:18AM on 3-03-2006
'almost universally' ?
You must be living in a small universe. Very few commentators in the mainstream media made any mention whatsoever of DVR. I would like to think Apple has something a little more innovative in mind (i.e. streaming) for its media center concept.
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djones said 11:21AM on 3-03-2006
I would just like to point out that many TUAW commenters made these same points in replies to TUAW's coverage of the event that predate the iLounge article.
Sorry if I don't remember everyone's names, but arkowi(sp) for sure had this one well ahead of anyone.
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Warren Frey said 11:28AM on 3-03-2006
I doubt Apple will come out with a DVR, for the reasons mentioned. But also (and I dunno if this is part of Apple's gameplan, but it dovetails nicely regardless) I've noticed my "television" viewing go down the drain in the last little while. Not only am I on the internet more often, or watching a movie either off of DVD or (ahem) other means, if I missed something and I want to see something badly enough, I'll just snag the torrent. That generally only boils down to the Simpsons, the Daily Show and new episodes of Dr. Who (wait a week for it to hit Canada? Are you insane?!?! :) ) but for that reason, the new Mini would probably suit me fine. I'll wait six months until they ramp it up a little, though. And Front Row? Meh. MediaCentral works with Xvids, and it's just as good.
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Mike said 11:30AM on 3-03-2006
A mac mini DVR would make many people happy. Add a TV option to front row, download the program guide for free off the net, allow tv shows to be recorded & automatically inserted into iTunes where it could be synced to your iPod. It's a perfect idea that a lot of people would embrace if it were implemented in an easy to use manner.
Tivo doesn't make any money off their, but that doesn't matter to Apple. They're already making money off their hardware business and this wouldn't detract from that at all, it would just steal more Tivo users away. Say Apple released this DVR for $1000 due to the enhanced functionality and allow the mac mini to be connected to an HDMI port (or the new protected port, don't remember it's name right now). They would make a killing on it not to mention all the video ipods that would be sold in conjunction with it. Apple could take an even larger share of the market in portable player sales.
The major constraints on this right now are hard drive size (since a portable HD is used in the mini) and the relationship with TV networks. They want to make money off their TV shows and sell them rather than let people get them for free. Sooner or later though, an easy to use system for recording TV quickly and allowing for portability will be developed and the first to the market will dominate the market. Apple's the prime candidate, they just need to realize it.
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Drew said 11:33AM on 3-03-2006
I agree with #2, however- Windows Media Center Edition is awfully slick and will be improved significantly with Vista's CableCard support. But even the current verison is light years ahead of FrontRow. I love my mini and FR, but it's functionality is limited.
DVRs can have messy and complicated connections. You have to consider analog cable, digital cable, SD/HD, satellite, and OTA inputs. Apple seems to be hedging their bets on on-demand content. Recording old-school broadcast TV doesn't interest them.
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LD said 11:35AM on 3-03-2006
Thanks, Captain Obvious!
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indolene said 11:44AM on 3-03-2006
My beef with Steve Jobs about this is (and this is simply my opinion) that while Apple products are very innovative and trend-setting, there are times when the man's desire to take your money overtakes his drive to innovate the products he sells you.
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Loki Capret said 11:45AM on 3-03-2006
Since many Macs are now coming with IR ports on them, how long until we see larger remotes with software that gives you more functionality over the entire OS? Much like key commands or shortcuts, a universal remote could potential give you a lot of control over your mac from across the room.
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Jon Hendry said 12:03PM on 3-03-2006
The flaw in the logic is that Apple didn't remove the ability to rip CDs when they opened the iTunes Music Store. Or, for that matter, they didn't limit iTunes to playing store-bought songs.
That would seem to be an equivalent situation.
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Jacob Varghese said 12:10PM on 3-03-2006
Jeff, #3, is totally right.
Apple makes their real money from selling hardware not from iTunes. After you include the costs of operating iTunes, there is only a very slim profit margin there.
Many more iPods and MACs would be sold if you could easily grab TV content from your MAC mini media center for your iPod.
Apple will end up doing it, but if they wait too long, it might hurt their business. It's only a matter of time before "boring little Windows boxes" with full dvr and media center functionality will be selling for under $500.
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Ed Shull said 12:50PM on 3-03-2006
Let's not forget that there are already thrid part DVR's for Apple. I'm not saying they are as good as they should be, but it does exsist. Also, remember that Apple hired one of the executive team from El Gato. I have to believe they will attack this market.
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The Jeremy said 1:47PM on 3-03-2006
Just because Apple sells content on the iTunes Store is no reason not to enable DVR functionality in the Macs. After all, some people will want a la carte via the iTunes Store without having to pay for cable television, while other users will continue to subscribe to cable television and thus would use the DVR capabilities. Being pragmatic instead of dogmatic would sell more Apple Mac Minis to the detriment of the Windows Media Center platform.
Its the same shortsightedness as evidenced by Apple refusing to enable OGG and FLAC functionality on the iPods. Adding such features would not cost Apple much money - especially since they are open source - and nor would it hurt AAC and Apple's AAC+Fairplay DRM from the iTunes Store. Yet it would continue to emasculate Windows WMA DRMed format as well as cut down on anti-iPod sentiment from those OGG/Flac supporters who instead buy iRivers. In this case, Apple's own stubbornness fuels its competitors. And yes, iRiver and Creative sell far less MP3 players than Apple but the point is Apple could use all the money it could get. Why feed the competition?
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Brian Duffy said 2:09PM on 3-03-2006
Its a non-issue -- people who buy Tivo still watch DVD and the general public still spends $10 to go to a movie theatre.
As broadband becomes more widespread and faster, buying movies & TV shows will become more and more critical. But today, the video you buy online just isn't as good as what is on TV or DVD. So Apple will need to support DVR to drive the sales of iMacs.
Until you have 200 million iPods in use out there & hooked to TVs Apple needs to sell high-margin hardware, and they need DVR capability to drive sales.
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Veronica said 2:16PM on 3-03-2006
That's good news! I bought a TiVo yesterday.
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