Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Hardware, MacBook
Farewell FireWire?
During the meta-liveblog yesterday, I was in full-out Apple fangirl mode. I won't lie; after the MacBook specs and design were revealed, I was already contemplating putting my current BlackBook (that I bought in August '07) on eBay or Craig's List, hoping that the RAM and hard drive upgrades and all the software I would include could net at least $900. Then I would buy a new MacBook.
After the dust settled and the specs were released, a dark cloud quickly dashed my plans: FireWire 400 ports are no longer included in the redesigned MacBook. The old style MacBook (now selling for $999) still includes FireWire 400, but the new beauties are FireWire free. What a bummer! Back in January, we listed lack of FireWire as one of the biggest downsides of the MacBook Air. On our Talkcast earlier this week, we actually discussed the idea of FireWire being withdrawn from the MacBook line. I thought it was plausible on the then-rumored $800 MacBook (a rumor that never materialized, sadly), but I was really, really hoping it wouldn't be removed from the line as a whole.
Whether the reason was based on user-feedback (which I'm sure Apple will claim), or done merely to force a schism between the "consumer" and "pro" lineups (as commenter Kai Cherry suggested), the net result is that a technology Apple has been pushing for nearly 10 years and that many of us have come to rely on, for external devices, target-disk mode and digital video needs, is no longer available in any laptop other than the MacBook Pro (or the older generation white MacBook).
No company has pushed IEEE-1394 (the technical name for FireWire) more than Apple (though Sony is close). The iPod was a FireWire device until its fifth revision in 2004 (USB adapters were available for the third and fourth generation units). Target Disk Mode is arguably one of the most useful Mac diagnostic tools. As long as you have a FireWire hard drive, you can safely migrate, repair or perform component tests on Mac, without damaging the internal drive.
As of right now, there is no true support for USB devices in target disk mode. Yes, you can boot from a USB device, but it's not the same as TDM. It's a shame that they are now phasing out this feature, and without a genuine successor. I don't want to start a USB 2.0 vs. FireWire 400 argument, but for sustained transfer, power consumption and the ability to daisy-chain devices, FireWire remains superior, especially under OS X (other operating systems don't benefit from FireWire as much). I mean, if you are going to get rid of FireWire, at least give us an eSATA port. That would at least be a better alternative for external drives than USB 2.0.
While it is true that FireWire-only devices are on a serious decline -- the latest generation of digital camcorders that use AVCHD and store data to SD cards all utilize USB 2.0, as do the vast majority of external devices -- are we really at the point that it is a "pros only" feature? It took years and years for consumers to finally ditch VHS-C and move on to miniDV. Are we already at the point that everyone has migrated to AVCHD and converted all their old footage digitally? Obviously, for existing Mac users who are just buying a new MacBook, this might not be a big deal. Use the iMac or an older MacBook for digital conversion. But this is still a blow to anyone who relies on (or -- shocking -- prefers) FireWire and wants to replace their primary machine.
There are bridge adapters available that will allow you to connect a FireWire device to a USB port, but they are expensive, and Windows XP-only. It is likely that a similar adapter will be created for the Mac, but how these devices will actually perform is questionable.
As a fervent supporter of the standard since 2000 (when I bought an OHCI compliant PCI card for my PC so that I could edit video at home or at school on an iMac DV), I have demanded FireWire support on every computer or laptop that I have purchased in the last 8 years. Buying a laptop without a FireWire port, that I will use as a primary computer, is frankly not an option for me. My next MacBook will have to be a MacBook Pro. And because spending another $1000 is a bit different from spending another $500, I won't be upgrading any time soon.
What are your thoughts? Is a FireWire-free MacBook a deal-breaker for you, or is it something you can live without? Do you know of any devices or cables that will help ease the transition? Sound off in the comments!
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Reader Comments (Page 6 of 12)
Olaf said 9:31AM on 10-20-2008
I don't understand why they did it. It's just so I don't know how to say but at last it's not cool
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turkay said 5:03PM on 10-15-2008
It's so obvious that Apple pushes people to the new MB Pros. I hope they'll realise this is not the right way to sell more Pros. Maybe we will see even more advanced/upgraded versions in the MB lineup, who knows?
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Chris said 5:05PM on 10-15-2008
No way in the nine hells I'll buy a machine without Firewire until or unless Apple comes out with/includes something better than Firewire to replace it. USB2 doesn't cut it.
Between no Firewire in the MacBook, limited utility in the Air, and a mandatory glossy screen on the Pro, I'll be holding onto my Early 2008 MacBook Pro for a long, loooong time. At least until Apple comes to its senses and realises that you never, ever take away features people have come to rely upon (Firewire, matte screens) until you have an acceptable alternative to replace it.
Yeah, they eradicated floppy drives from the line in the late 90s, and people crapped themselves, but it really turned out that floppies were on their way out the door anyway. But countless creative professionals still use Firewire devices, and they still require a matte screen for correct colour calibration, something nearly impossible to achieve on a glossy screen. Without those features, there isn't a single notebook that Apple offers now that's an acceptable computer for a true "pro" other than the now laughably-overpriced and underpowered 17" "refresh" model MBP.
I've been defending Macs against people who accuse them of being "form over function" for years. I can't do that anymore, because now it's true.
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Jackson said 5:03PM on 10-15-2008
The biggest deal for me is target disk mode. I use it to run diskwarrior every couple months and it's an extremely nice feature to have. Booting from a CD could work but it's kind of slow and I'm not even sure if there's a way to make a custom Leopard book disk (is there?).
I only have one device that uses firewire, my external backup HD. But it also uses USB so I could always buy a USB cable and use it that way. But not having target disk mode for maintenance and diagnostics will be a real bummer.
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Justin said 5:06PM on 10-15-2008
Thanks a lot. I hate sites that make you register to download stuff.
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Blainer said 5:31PM on 10-15-2008
Total deal-breaker. I was all ready to go buy a new Macbook because my SR Macbook Pro was just too big for me but once I found out it had no firewire, the first thing I did instead was buy a black macbook instead. Lack of firewire and being an video editor kills me. I hope apple brings it back in another generation.
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Dan Oblak - MacBigot.com said 1:33AM on 10-16-2008
This was the other thing that I was just WAITING for someone to bring up -- SIZE MATTERS. There have been a LOT of commenters here saying that 'Pros should use Pro computers'; yeah, yeah, we get it... BUT if you happen to think that being a road-warrior means packing _well_ is more importnt than having that extra inch or so of screen real estate, the MacBook Pro is just TOO MUCH Mac (that is, it's too BIG).
I was teetering between distraught and angry when I say that Apple went from the 12" PowerBook and iBook to the 13" MacBook -- that's too big! If we HAD to go to a wider screen, then 1280x800 is nice, but at 12" or less, please.
I am a 'Pro', but more of a 'Mobile Pro' than a 'Creative Pro'. But with this de-featured set, an upgrade to the new MacBook is out of the question (what I was really hoping for was a 10" at least 1024 pixels wide).
My needs are not about horsepower -- but instead functionality, versatility, mobility, and having no limits (compared to the guy in the next seat with a Winbox on his tray).
When Apple took away the modem, I began to suspect that the folks in Cupertino don't travel to the same major cities that I do, nor do they stay in the same major hotel chains that I do (which believe it or not, either don't yet have broadband for travellers or don't have it working when I need it).
This time, I suspect that Apple thinks that all travelling business people like carrying a larger, heavier machine, and that all business computers are expensed (they aren't) to an employer. The size and the cost TOGETHER make the MacBook not just attractive, but NECESSARY.
That, coupled with the fact that they just shot holes all over the iMovie advantage (which has all but died for me since the latest 'upgrades' anyway), means that I will be looking this next month into what open source software can replace iLife for me.
I already have a good start from last year: http://macbigot.com/?p=983
ercpck said 5:09PM on 10-15-2008
This firewire elimination might be temporal....
Remember when the new macbook pros came into the market? none had firewire 800, or dual layer dvd burners... just like the previous generation Powerbooks....
But since Apple was rushing to get the products out.... the pushed the products without those features... once the products where revised, the features where added.
Look at the Macbook Air... it was shipped with an intel video adapter.... now it was revised to use nvidia.
...Let's not even talk about the first iphone firmware vs. the current generation....
So, basically, Apple gets the product out just in time for holidays, they sell a lot, to those that don't want/don't need the firewire issue, and then what? they update the configuration when they revise the models.
Therefore there is no reason to think that the firewire will not be added later.... everytime you rush into buying the new model, you end up being the guinea pig.
IMHO the line that separates the kids from the adults in the macbook pro line is the ExpressCard slot.... if you really want to do professional video, as in PD or XDCAM, or use an AJA, you cannot rely on the Firewire 800 port alone, you need to add a second storage subsystem, either via an eSata adapter, or another firewire 800 expresscard slot.
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patrick said 5:08PM on 10-15-2008
dealbreaker.
not enough to get a MBP now, so it really was a dealbreaker.
And seriously, why...
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Jon said 5:10PM on 10-15-2008
As someone who used to repair Macs many people who never used Firewire found it to be very helpful when I was able to recover important files from a corrupted OS using Target Disk. You can't do that with USB or ethernet. The only option on the new MacBook is to physically remove the hard drive and install it in an enclosure or use a boot disk. I'm guessing that Apple will hear from many grumbling Genius Bar people once they have to start dealing with firewireless Macs.
Firewire is a niche thing but it is like the diagnostic computer on your car. You don't use it all that often but when you need it it is REALLY nice to have.
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Pepi said 5:25PM on 10-15-2008
An ABSOLUTE deal breaker. We have many FireWire devices and the medical University here definitely will NOT buy ANY Mac without FireWire as makes it impossible to support these machines. The MacBook "Pro" is not an option for students who have to buy these machines themselves.
Apple really has to come up with a very, very quick update that includes FireWire or they will loose a lot of University sales ll over the planet and business/enterprise sales as well.
Best regards
Pepi
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Mac-Convert said 5:15PM on 10-15-2008
Did I miss something? How other than firewire can I create a bootable backup of my OS?
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drjuice said 5:28PM on 10-15-2008
You could use a program like Carbon Copy Cloner to make a block-for-block copy onto a USB drive. Intel Macs can boot from USB drives.
As for Target Disk Mode and troubleshooting/recovery, removing the drives in the new notebooks consists of a latch and one captive screw, so with a $20 SATA/USB adapter, you're back in business.
Sean said 5:30PM on 10-15-2008
You can boot off of a USB drive just as easily.
uhuznaa said 5:34PM on 10-15-2008
Isn't it totally clear? If the MacBook with the new case and faster graphics still included FireWire hardly anyone would see the need to buy a MBP and Apple would have a problem. It's that simple. They would probably sell low enough numbers of the MBP that it wouldn't be worth it at all anymore. So they decided to pull FW from the MacBook to force those who really need (and not merely want) FW to buy a MBP instead.
Come on, how many of you would spend all this money for a MacBook Pro just to get FW800 and a modestly larger display if the MacBook still had FW400?
It may hurt, but from Apples POV it actually makes sense. And most customers won't care anyway, FireWire is rapidly going the way of SCSI.
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Stevo said 5:24PM on 10-15-2008
As the owner of a MacBook 2.16Ghz, I was looking forward to upgrading to a new 13 in MacBook that has better graphics performance, until I found out that no firewire port is available. Apple will now charge me a $1000 premium for a portable that has firewire support. I prefer the smaller 13 in size, and that is the main reason I have never purchased a 15 in or 17 in MacBook Pro or PowerBook. In addition, Apple has changed the video port connector, so that the current connectors I have will no longer work. Smells very much like the Apple iPod Universal Dock scam that requires me to buy a new dock and cables in order to enable video out on the latest generation of iPods. I will probably buy a refurbished 15 in MacBook Pro. This is really starting to get old. ...and given the economic climate, I am really puzzled by the ongoing corporate greed at Apple.
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Michael said 5:19PM on 10-15-2008
I think it is utter and ubber bullshit to not include it. I love the macbook... will buy my wife a new one in time... but damn... it really needs firewire for her video camera!!!! please Apple.. correct this.. please???
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puhsitch said 5:19PM on 10-15-2008
Y'all need to calm down! This is what Apple does...they often put out a product that's missing things that people want, but they always manage to eventually fill in holes one way or another. The new MacBook will sell well right off the bat with people who don't care about FireWire. And Apple knows that many people won't buy it because of the lack of FireWire. Some of those people will buy MBPs when they may not have otherwise -- score one for Apple. Then the rest will snatch up the next revision that somehow manages to appease them.
Apple is too good at generating potential energy and squeezing what they can out of customers who are riding the fence between the pro and consumer lines.
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Dan Oblak - MacBigot.com said 5:23PM on 10-15-2008
I waited -- for years -- before buying my first Mac laptop, because although I really liked all the things I could co with SCSI, I understood the benefits of having a truly *intelligent* interface like FireWire; and so when the Pismo hit the streets, I finally put my life in hock and had one mailed to me.
(Never mind the fact that within a couple of years, the first all-white iBook had better specs, and cost more than a thousand dollars less...)
Target disk mode is indeed one of the most 'Apple-like' advantages of FireWire; but it is also what made shopping for a camcorder such a joy for Mac users -- and is still the best reason for iMovie (which, by the way, we are still angry at Apple for since they actually REDUCED functionality in since previous versions in an obvious attempt to get users to upgrade to Final Cut Express).
What major Apple feature will be next to go?
- QuickTime? No, they already did that when the company started to charge $30 just for the capability to cut/copy/paste and export segments of video (which we used to be able to do with the free version).
- Online services? No, they already did that when they told Apple customers that they could have a free .Mac email address for life, and then began charging $100/year for it.
- Modems? No, they already took that away with the last generation of MacBook/Pro/Air.
- Ethernet? No, that's already gone from the Air; and probably won't be present if Apple ever gets around to a subnotebook.
It's nice that the new laptops are USB-bootable; but I haven't seen Apple release a special version of the MacOS that is optimized for use this way (which isn't a big deal, except that I know I will be out of license compliance every time I build one). So this isn't advertised/recommended aggressively on their web site.
Now that there is no compelling reason to do video editting on a Mac laptop (that WAS iMovie until they castrated it, and then it WAS FireWire until they removed it), my next mobile workstation may turn out to run on Linux.
Damn -- I'll even have to change my domain. Again. Grrr.
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Matt Kern said 5:32PM on 10-15-2008
In addition to the sad loss of firewire, it was also sad that an EpressCard slot was not added. If it was, there would be a cheap and effective firewire transfer.
It's even disappointing that Apple dropped FW400 on the Macbook Pro. What about people you still shoot MiniDV, or use tape decks such as DVCPro?
What gives Apple? This release is super sloopy. Since when has Apple released a model, and kept the old models as the entry level, and in the case of the Macbook Pro, the high end model?
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