Psystar wins a battle, legal war just getting started
Previously in the Apple-Psystar legal battle, the clone maker amended its countersuit to charge that Apple was unfairly leveraging its copyright by binding Mac OS X to Mac hardware.
On Friday, the federal judge assigned to the case ruled that the amendment will be heard by the court, a small victory for Psystar. It's something of a reversal for the company, since they had federal antitrust allegations thrown out in November. Similarly, Psystar's assertion that Apple is in violation of California's antitrust laws was thrown out Friday as well.
Judge William Alsup said, "Psystar may well have a legitimate interest in establishing misuse [of copyright] independent of Apple's claims against it -- for example, to clarify the risks it confronts by marketing the products at issue in this case or others it may wish to develop." This isn't to say that the judge necessarily agrees with Psystar's point, but just that it's legally reasonable enough to be argued in court.
Apple has also not yet revealed its 10 "John Doe" defendants: alleged conspirators who worked on Psystar's technique for loading Mac OS X on non-Apple hardware.
The case will decide whether or not Apple can disallow other hardware makers -- including Psystar -- from including Mac OS X on computers shipped to end users. Last week, a company in Germany claimed that Mac OS X's End User License Agreement didn't apply to them, and is selling Mac clones to customers.
The case is scheduled to go to trial on November 9.
[Via Macworld.]
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Previously in the Apple-Psystar legal battle, the clone maker amended its countersuit to charge that Apple was unfairly leveraging its...
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It might seem like a silly question, but who exactly does Psystar buy their copies of OSX from? Are they going into retail shops (unlikely), or are they buying in bulk from wholesalers (I'm thinking), or do they buy the software directly from Apple?
If I were Apple, and I didn't want someone to install my software on a machine I didn't make, I wouldn't sell it to them. Apple should find the distribution channel, and shut it down. If Psystar can't buy OSX, they can't install it...
Don't tell me Apple can't track individual copies of their software; validation codes, serial numbers, etc., there's all kinds of info specific to each copy. Apple already knows who Psystar's supplier is, I'm willing to bet.
the way i see it is its like buying a software CD for your Merc, would you expect it to work in a BMW?
If you dont like what is in the EULA, then dont buy OSX on its own.
A Mac is a solution, like a Navman or cellphone, should Nokia let you install thier software on a Motorolla?
The only issue i could think of is apple sells OSX seperately
not sure what the controversy here is.
just because it's in a TOC doesn't mean you can't take an opinion on whether it's the right thing for apple to do or not.
I think what some folks fail to realize just because Apple states in their TOC that OSX cannot be installed in non-Apple hardware doesn't make it legal. Its part of the agreement, but Psytar basically is saying those terms are not legal. For example if you make a contract with someone to assault someone for some money that is an illegal contract and cannot be enforced. I know that is an extreme example, but basically Psytar is saying Apple cannot force such an agreement to a party that legitmately purchases the product.
February 09 2009 at 7:30 PM Report abuse Permalink rate up rate down Reply@Albert
you are forgetting that Apple only considers what is being sold an "upgrade" license. IANAL, so I don't know what is legal, but Psystar is definitely in the gray area in copyright law here.
I think Apple may be using this as a testing grounds to see how well a third-party Mac will sell. I assume outside of their main selling area, they are doing quite well, but I think most people buying a Mac in the US are going to buy from Apple themselves. They are not just selling to hard core users like they were in the 90s, and I am sure many of their Pro users would like some options for system choice, but I still think most would buy from Apple themselves only.
I'd rather just buy the OS and not actually buy the Mac, because for what it's worth, I'd build my machine with a Core 2 Quad, 6GB RAM, a 9800 GTX, and 2 TB hard drive. Currently this is not possible with the current Mac solutions. This is why I went to OSX86. I get all the power of OS X, without the limitation of Apple's lackluster hardware specifications (and not to mention the hefty price tag that comes with it). All in all, I can buy all the hardware I want in my machine, buy OS X, do some magic and I have OS X running on my PC at full speed at half (or less) of the price. People are pirating more than just the OS itself too. Many people are pirating iWork and iLife, so I would say that Apple should worry about the people actually ripping of their hard work and not about the people who want to legitimately buy the OS and [hack it to] run on their (third-party) hardware.
Just my 2 cents.
The "Macs are overpriced" argument is getting really old. Does your "half price, full speed" box have an array of temperature sensing variable speed fans? It it made entirely of aluminum? Does it have an entirely custom designed 1kw power supply specifically made to fit your case? How many internal sensors does it have? Is less than 25? RAID-style plug and play hard drive bays? Is it nearly completely silent at all times?
The point, in case it hasn't been made clear yet, is that with Macs you get what you pay for. It's not "excessive", it's not "overpriced". Contrary to popular belief, R&D is not free, and neither is custom manufacturing. You get what you pay for.
If you don't need sensors that tell you what the rotation speed of your intake and exhaust fans are on CPU B, that's great. But the Mac Pro has them, and you're paying for them when you buy a Mac Pro, whether you're going to use it or not. That's not overpriced. That's getting what you're paying for.
Feel free to build a box that costs less, but make no mistake: you are getting less. That's all there is to it.
Is it just me or does this sound like communism? I understand the "soveignty" issue that's been mentioned... but why would Apple sell OSX individually at all if they absolutely did not, under no circumstances, want OSX installed on anything other than mac hardware? If they sell it and I can buy it legally, it would seem to me that MY legal copy of OSX would be mine to do with what I pleased. If I wanted to build my own system to get exactly what I wanted and save a few bucks in the process, it should be 100% legal for me to do so... This is essentially what Pystar offered customers. What's the big deal?
February 09 2009 at 5:01 PM Report abuse Permalink rate up rate down ReplyCommunism: Everyone gets CP/M to use, and hates it.
Socialism: Everyone gets Windows XP to use, and it's all right, but half of your income goes to pay for it.
Fascism: Nobody gets a computer except for one guy, and the entire economy is dedicated to manufacturing the operating system.
Anarchy: Linux.
The big deal is that Pystar is turning a profit, while violating the terms of service that they agreed upon when they bought that product (OSX). Just like with Copy write laws there is not much a company can do about me copying a movie I bought, from VHS and turning it into a AVI to save a few buck on a new version to watch, but they can peruse legal action if I then start distributing that AVI movie to others, at a cost or not. This is because when you buy anything you are begin bound by the terms of service of that product. It would be nice if when I bought something I owned all legal rights to it but that is not the case. The company that makes the product (In this case Apple) poured hundreds of thousands (Even millions) of dollars and many many hours of man power to make and own all exclusive rights to that product, just because you plunked down 78$ does not mean that you have higher ownership of that product then the maker. Besides just because you can do something doesn't make it right, I thought that is the reason we have laws.
February 09 2009 at 5:23 PM Report abuse Permalink rate up rate down ReplyWouldn't the easiest solution for Apple be to allow individuals and companies to install OS X, but explicitly tell them they will not provide support for such machines. If you want technical support and warranty coverage from Apple, you must buy Apple hardware. In other words Apple can market this as:
piece of mind that it "just works" = Apple
unsupported hacking = hackintoshes
You decide.
Personally, I love my hackintosh eee pc 900HA. A perfect mac netbook for circa $300 in my opinion. But I still love and own a mac pro, mac mini, and macbook. The eee pc is just better for travel.
"Wouldn't the easiest solution for Apple be to allow individuals and companies to install OS X, but explicitly tell them they will not provide support for such machines. If you want technical support and warranty coverage from Apple, you must buy Apple hardware."
While this is one of the more practical solutions, it would still hit Apple's brand pretty hard. When you start putting Mac OS X on a dizzying number of PCs, with 1000s of possible hardware combinations/components.. your OS will undoubtedly suffer. This contributes (somewhat) to the crappy reputation Windows has. Conversely, a lot of the 'Apple experience®' comes from the way Apple integrates their software with /their own/ hardware.
Your idea isn't necessarily a bad way to go.. but I just don't see Apple going down that road. They're still a hardware company. The software (OS X, iTunes, iLife, iWork, etc) is just a means to an end (selling more Macs).
Even though it is costly and limiting, there is absolutely nothing wrong with requiring the software to be used on proprietary hardware. The company creating the software and hardware have sovereignty over the TOS.
February 09 2009 at 4:29 PM Report abuse Permalink rate up rate down ReplyStace, might I point out your completely missing the point just to pick an argument about fanboyism? Hell we all do it. But, again, not the point.
What was stated is fact, so just gulp it up and understand; APPLE OWNS THE OSX OS. They built it, and it's in their legal doctrine that OS X cannot be legally used on anything OTHER than Apple hardware.
There's no running around it, jumping through loopholes or any other form of attempting to avoid it; IT'S CLEARLY STATED. Why on earth people think they can take this fact on and win is beyond me. Hey it's a great OS, I love it. But, there's no need to stress over it. Put simply; it's illegal to put it on anything other than Apple hardware. You can't analyze it any other way, stop trying too.
Not ranting, making a statement of fact. You can either be rational about it, or completely ignore everything I've just told you and all the legal facts, and start ranting about "fanboyism", "arguing over the internet" and how crap Apple is.
So, erm, how much of Psystar Profit is headed into the the OSX86 Community- Especially since they're probably using code or methods developed by the community.
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