Filed under: Analysis / Opinion, Software, Odds and ends, Freeware, iPhone, App Store
Financial site Mint.com releases iPhone app
I've been using Mint.com (not to be confused with Shawn Inman's great Mint web stats tracker) to track my financial information for a while now. It's very nice -- completely free, and hooks right into your bank accounts, investments, or other financial accounts online (securely, of course -- they've got over 7,500 institutions in the system) to let you know what you're spending, when, and where. I'm lazy when it comes to budgets, but Mint will automatically make budgets for you based on what you spent the month before, so I can see if my groceries, bus fare, or, ahem, iPhone app budgets go over one month.And now they're released an iPhone app, so you can have access to all of that information on the go. It's pretty much a portable Mint -- you've got all of your usual account information, alerts are pushed off onto their own screen, so you can see at a glance where you're overspending, and you can flip through and see your expenses for the month, where your cash is going, and any budgets you've programmed into Mint. The app is quick and easy to use -- like Mint.com, but in the palm of your hand. It's free and on the App Store right now (though of course you have to set yourself up on their website first).
One security issue: the app wisely recommends that if you don't have a passcode on your phone already, you put one on it, since your financial information will be available to anyone using your phone. The Mint.com folks also tell us that you can disable iPhone app access from their website, so even if you do lose your phone, you can keep unwanted users from reaching your information. But as with everything, there's a tradeoff of convenience and security -- while it's helpful to have this information anywhere you are, the flip side is that it's that much more likely to fall into the wrong hands.
Get a WordPress.com Blog
![TUAW [Cafepress]](http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.tuaw.com/media/tuaw-cafepress-promo.png)
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Joe Russell said 3:25PM on 12-19-2008
Meh...
I've been using Mint.com for a while too, but socks were blown off the day I tried PageOnce, and they too have an iPhone app.
J.
Reply
Nick said 3:29PM on 12-19-2008
For anyone familiar with Mint or services like it: What assurances do we have, as end users, that our information (bank account numbers, credit card numbers) isn't being used in bad ways? I mean, isn't this risky at all?
lakiolen said 3:55PM on 12-19-2008
Looking at PageOnce's site doesn't inspire a lot of confidence, they barely show how it works or looks.
Nick said 3:32PM on 12-19-2008
For anyone familiar with Mint or services like it: What assurances do we have, as end users, that our information (bank account numbers, credit card numbers) isn't being used in bad ways? I mean, isn't this risky at all?
(Sorry for the double post...Didn't mean to originally post it as a reply...)
Reply
lakiolen said 3:50PM on 12-19-2008
http://www.mint.com/privacy/
DrWho said 3:55PM on 12-19-2008
I'd recommend spending some time on their website and looking at what they have to say about security and privacy, like here for example, http://www.mint.com/privacy/
If you come away feeling re-assured then use it. Basically the argument is that 1) mint is readonly and 2) they don't see or store your login info and 3) your financial information is available on the web through your bank anyway and finally 4) mint actually provides you with more security because you get notifications of events that you define as unusual spending patterns.
emil said 3:58PM on 12-19-2008
I used Mint for a while until I learned that I was violating my bank and credit card's TOS by providing Mint with my credentials. If you violate the terms, you are not legally afforded the same level of protection if someone gains unauthorized access to your account. For example, I had an unauthorized withdrawal of $2500 last year (before I used Mint), and one of the questions they asked me was "Have you given your username, password, or PIN to anyone?" The answer was no, but had it been yes, I suspect I wouldn't have been entitled to protection on that amount.
I don't doubt that Mint is secure with their info, but it's worth noting that they obtain their data by screen scraping, which is very sketch. Why don't they have access via XML or something authorized?
If the open up their service to let you upload statement PDF files or CSVs, and parse those, I might reconsider using their service.
Reply
Nick said 4:29PM on 12-19-2008
How did you phrase your question when inquiring about whether or not this violated your banks ToS? I'd just like to know so I can ask my bank...
eugene said 5:49PM on 12-19-2008
Mint doesn't need your pin and doesn't ask for it. Most of the US banks I know don't allow wire-transfer from the online interface thus making username/password info useless for this kind of fraud.
Of course you increase risk by giving away your account information. But you do exactly the same it every time you write a check.
emil said 6:11PM on 12-19-2008
Citibank wanted my username, password, and ATM PIN to set it up.
I am less concerned about credit cards, since all you can do by logging into Amex.com is see your statements.
The fact still remains that they're screen-scraping your financial information, which is an awful programming practice and indicative of unauthorized use of information.
emil said 6:13PM on 12-19-2008
And again, I'm not suggesting mint.com would try to steal my money, just that by providing your credentials to a third party, you are violating the terms you agreed to when you signed up for online access. Doesn't that bother you?
Aaron Patzer said 6:36PM on 12-19-2008
Regardless of your banks Terms of Service, you are protected from loss and liability by law:
In short, Regulation Z means $0 of liability on credit card fraud, and Regulation E means $50 of liability on your checking account.
For a fuller answer:
Mint’s terms of service reflect the fact that limited liability rests with
Mint.com. First, the company has taken extensive steps to ensure customer
security and privacy. Log-in requires no personal information beyond an
email address; Mint.com stores no banking passwords; has a one way
connection to the 7,500 financial institutions it works with; is VeriSign
secured, is TRUSTe-certified; and is protected from hacking by ScanAlert and
from phishing attacks by RSA.
Second, Mint.com has neither the personal information nor the ability to
move money or make payments. The company offers a “read only” service,
displaying past transactions and current balances. The site doesn't store
information that would facilitate ID theft.
Third, Mint.com alerts are designed specifically to help its users take full
advantage of the liability protection afforded by the state and federal laws
which limit consumers’ potential losses from the fraudulent use of credit
cards and online banking services provided by US financial institutions.
Regulation E, under the Electronic Funds Transfer Act, protects consumers
from unauthorized debits from their bank accounts provided they notify their
bank upon discovery of any fraud. Regulation Z of the Fair Credit Billing
Act, ensures that consumers bear $0 liability for unauthorized credit card
transactions. Mint.com users are proactively alerted via email or SMS text
message about unusual spending, large transactions, low balances and other
key indicators of identity theft in any of their accounts. This enables them
to notify their bank or credit card provider promptly, and more quickly stop
and recover from financial or identity losses, actually decreasing their
risk and liability for theft and identity fraud.
Aaron Patzer, Founder & CEO, Mint.com
Jeremy said 12:56AM on 12-20-2008
Aaron,
Thanks for your response. I actually just signed up for a Mint.com account after it was brought to my attention by the iPhone app. The wife and I really enjoyed viewing some of our personal trends and look forward to following them.
This thread raised some genuine concerns, and I'm glad to read your thorough response. It's also reassuring and humanizing to see a CEO poke his head into a comment thread. I wish you success.
emil said 9:29AM on 12-20-2008
Aaron,
Thanks for your response. I'm still not sold on the fact that I have to violate my bank's terms (providing a third party with my login credentials) in order to take advantage of your service. Regardless, I'm curious to hear your thoughts on why Mint screen scrapes financial data. As I'm sure you know, screen scraping data constitutes unauthorized use of information and also violates many bank and credit card terms of service.
Nick said 12:26PM on 12-20-2008
Aaron, thanks for your input on this story! We really appreciate you alleviating (or at least attempting to) our fears. I have one main question for you though....How exactly does "Mint" make money for you guys? What is your source of income in this? I see no ads on your site and you provide a free service for the end user so I believe this is a valid question.
emil said 12:30PM on 12-20-2008
Nick, I know one way they make money is on that "Save" page where they show the amount of money you could save by switching banks or credit cards. They get paid a commission for each referral.
Jon said 4:29PM on 12-19-2008
Does anyone know of any UK equivalents?
Reply
Reg said 8:16PM on 12-19-2008
Mint.com is just using Yodlee as their backend. Yodlee is also free and is more feature rich than Mint is. I prefer them over Mint.com.
Just so that you know, there shouldn't be any legal or TOS issues using either of them as Bank of America uses Yodlee (portfolio services). I don't see banks using services from companies that violate their terms.
Reply
vandil said 1:06AM on 12-20-2008
I just do not see the wisdom in involving a third party into your financial matters out of "convenience."
You have an iPhone, that should be plenty convenient:
- Use your Calendar app to plan/track payments.
- Use Safari to check your transactions & balances online.
- Use the handy Phone feature to call the automated account line.
And people seriously wonder why they become victims of fraud...
Reply
Jeremy said 2:28AM on 12-20-2008
For me it's not so much convenience (though there is that) as it is being presented with the big picture. Mint categorizes all of your expenses from multiple accounts automatically (with a little help) so you can see graphs of where the money is going. I don't know what bank you're using, but mine sure doesn't offer that service on their web site. Still, the utility of an app like this probably varies greatly on a number of personal factors (e.g. how many financial institutions you do business with).